When Dr. Anthony Fauci and “Sunday Morning” special contributor Ted Koppel first met on camera, remote interviews were still a novelty and the nation set its sights on a global epidemic called HIV- AIDS. Koppel, then of ABC’s “Nightline,” asked Fauci, “How optimistic are you about some kind of vaccine?”
“Two vaccines are in the first phase of testing to determine safety, but it won’t be until the 1990s, if we’re lucky, to have a vaccine. It won’t be until at least 1995,” he replied.
Even 33 years ago, Fauci had wide national following, but especially among AIDS activists who were often highly critical; and had not yet inspired any video, T-shirt, cup of coffee, or suggestion of impending holiness, as he has recently done.
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“Oh, my God,” said Fauci, when he was shown a particularly holy portrait of himself. “My nuns of Our Lady of Guadalupe in Brooklyn would turn in her grave when they saw it!”
There are also other types of Fauci artifacts:
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And then there’s a July 22 Sinclair Broadcasting video, “America This Week,” in which a researcher with chronic fatigue syndrome, Dr. Judy Mikovits, stated, “I think Dr. Fauci made the coronaviruses.”
“You know, Ted, I think this is a dramatic example of division in our country,” Fauci said. “We have had a complete distortion and discard of facts and scientific evidence. And a certain part of the country believed the aspect of counterfeiting, the aspect of fake news.
“The other half longed for clarity, longed for the facts, longed for the truth. So, for better or worse, for one reason or another, I became an unrealistic symbol. Like St. Anthony. You know, it’s well, okay, great, but that’s not reality.
“On the other hand, I’ve had people who have threatened my life because I’m talking about public health measures,” Fauci said.
Koppel said, “We have a video about you and your wife walking around with a safety detail. Has it arrived?”
“Yeah. Yeah. It got to that. I’ve sparked so much animosity that I have to have federal agents, armed federal agents, with me, as always.”
“Have your children been threatened?”
“I have to tell you I’m not afraid of myself, for myself,” Fauci said. “But what really worries me is the harassment, the continued harassment of my three daughters. The lunatics, you know, they know who they are, they know where they live, they know what their phone number is, they know where they work. M ‘angry.’
Koppel said, “Let’s talk about us, America. Here we are, we have 4% of the world’s population. There have been two million fatalities worldwide. If we had our share, we would have had 80,000.”
“Right.”
“It simply came to our notice then five times this number “.
“Right.”
“We’ve been an abject failure, Tony.”
“Uh, eh. Yeah. The reasons for that, Ted, I don’t think I can articulate them all, but some stand out to me because I’ve lived them. You can’t have mixed messages. You can’t have the politicization of public health messages. I mean, the idea of whether or not to wear a mask became a political statement? That makes it harder to implement a good public health measure. “
Koppel said, “You have a very expressive face. And there’s a moment (you’ll know right away what I’m talking about) in the White House press room. I want you to finally reveal what was going through your mind during that session moment. of information. “
“Well,” Fauci said, “what I think you’re referring to is when we were in that situation where we’re talking about hydroxychloroquine.”
President Trump: “It may work, it may not work. I feel good. It’s all it is, just a feeling. You know, smart man.”
“And he was up there talking about it and I just think I went like that (he puts his hand face to face).”
-Yes.
“I did it instinctively. And I said to myself, Oh my goodness!, and unfortunately it became the scene that shot around the world. “
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“People have gotten to a point where they don’t understand that about President Trump: he can actually be an extraordinarily charming man,” Koppel said.
“Yes. You’re right,” Fauci said. “He’s a charismatic person. I got along very, very well with him. But I didn’t like having to correct clear misrepresentations in the field of medicine and science.”
Fauci: “I’m not entirely sure what the president was referring to …”
“I think that bothered his staff, his loyal staff, in some ways, even more than it bothered him. So that’s when things started to go in the wrong direction.”
President Trump: “You have this high approval rating. So why don’t I have a high approval rating regarding and administration regarding the virus?”
“So the relationship wore off a little bit. And then when I saw him in the oval office, I would act like everything was fine.
“And then we went through that famous time when people sang ‘Fire Fauci! Fire Fauci!’ and he said, “Hey, it’s not a bad idea. I think I will. “
President Trump at a Nov. 1 rally: “Don’t tell anyone, but let me wait until a little after the election. He’s been very wrong. He’s a nice man, but he’s been very wrong.”
Koppel asked, “With more consistent leadership, we could have saved many lives. Is that a fair statement?”
“Yes, I think so,” Fauci replied. “I mean, I think if we had had the public health messages (from the top right to the people in the trenches) we would be consistent, that things could have been different. In fact, I’m sure they would have been different. “.
It is a measure of the durability of Tony Fauci, who, at the age of 80, has just taken on a new degree, working for Joe Biden – his seventh president – as chief medical adviser.
“What we will see over the next few months is much more of a synergistic and coordinated collaboration between the federal government and the states,” Fauci said. “So I think we’ll see a change in attitude when the federal government and the states start working together a lot more, instead of ‘You’re Alone.'”
“Yeah, but I mean you’ve already been talking and experiencing your own grief, the poison of partisanship that exists. That won’t go away, Tony.”
“Well, no, it’s not. What do we do, on average, between 200,000 and 300,000 infections a day; about 3,000 to 4,000 deaths a day? I mean, you have to look at those numbers and say, ‘We have to do something different.’ ‘”
Koppel said, “Your first big challenge will be to get the vaccines in your arms.”
“Right now things are getting better, but they will get a lot better because President Biden has made it very clear that this is his top priority. You know that the goal set, which I think is entirely achievable, is to have 100 million people vaccinated during the first 100 days … primary and reinforcement “.
“In 100 days?”
“Yeah yeah.”
“Do you realize you’re preparing for disaster if you don’t meet that goal?” Koppel asked.
“Of course, and that’s one of the things that refreshed one of the first briefings we had with President Biden and Vice President Harris, is that he said,‘ We could have setbacks. But do you know when this happens we will do it? We will not point fingers. We will not blame people. We will not hide anything. We will be totally transparent and honest and try to fix it. ‘”
“We’ve had four years, Tony, from the top – undermining trust in all of our institutions: intelligence, FBI, media, science. This has been such a pandemic, hasn’t it?”
“Yes,” Fauci said. “And we have to fix it. We have to do it. Because the country is at stake.”
“Do you have any idea how to get started? No vaccination.”
“No, there is no vaccination. But I think maybe we should continue to lead by example that being united is much, much better than being a divisor. Because the division has really failed. I mean, it has failed us anyway.” .
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Story produced by Dustin Stephens. Editor: Steven Tyler.